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building 建筑[jian zhu]

最近画了一张。我觉得有个话题挺有意思的,叫“中国符号”,很多人谈论中国艺术家应不应该用“中国符号”这个问题,它相对的是全球化的符号——我也不知道全球化符号大概是什么东西,就只有一个概念。我的感觉是,中国符号没什么不好的,……美国人每天到处都在他们的符号,也没有问题,那为什么中国人用符号就有问题呢?我觉得就是有志于中国符号进行到底的那种人……作为一个中国艺术家,目的是什么?是张扬自己的文化还是消灭自己的文化?这是一个问题。所以我想用最传统中国方式去做当代艺术。我画了一幅长卷,这长卷大概有五十米长,是长安街的街景,把长安街每一个建筑都同时记录在里边,因为长安街大概是十五公里长,我是按1300的比例做,就正好五十米长。同时我按中国画以前方式——我了好多个图章,那些图章都是北京消失胡同名字。这就是我最近做的东西。

I made a painting recently. I always find a topic interesting: “China symbol.” Many have debated on whether Chinese artists should deploy the “China symbol.” Its antithesis is the globalization symbol – I have no idea what that might be like; I only know of the concept. My feeling is that there is nothing wrong with the China Symbol. The Americans are flaunting their Symbol everyday, and nobody has any problem with that. Then why would you have problem with the Chinese using their own Symbol? I think I’m the kind of person who will take the China Symbol to the end. As a Chinese artist, what is your goal? To promote your own culture or to extinguish your own culture? That is the question. So I decide to do contemporary art using the most traditional Chinese methods. I painted a long scroll, about 50 meters in length, of the scenery along the Chang’an Boulevard in Beijing, recording each building alongside. The Chang’an Boulevard is about 15 kilometers in length, and I painted it at the scale of 1:300, so it turned out to be 50 meters. And at the same time, with the traditional way of ancient Chinese painting, I carved many seals, displaying the names of the Hutong alleys that have disappeared in Beijing. That is my latest work.

(摘自徐坦对卢思沉的访谈   Excerpt from Interview with Lu Sichen)

Interviewed: Lu Sichen

Time: Afternoon, Jan. 30, 2007

Location: Fansi(Fancy) Restaurant, 4th Ring Road, Beijing

社会 social     18

市场 market    11

机构 institutions  organizations   11

边缘 periphery    7

居住 housing living          5

北京 Beijing        63

邻居 neighbors      5

符号 symbol      10

中国符号 China symbol     6

胡同 Hutong  alleys      10

国家    country    5

弱势群体   under-privileged groups     7

日本    Japan      6

热门  hot  3

老百姓 citizens residents 5

环境  context  13

拍卖  auction 8

价格  price, worth   5

价值  value  8

关系  relationship  21

人际关系  interpersonal relationship   2

拆迁  demolishing and rebuilding  3

西方  the West  4

建筑  building  9

位置  status  4

装修  decoration project interior decoration  3

  circle   1

Source of keywords:

Q: Could you please first comment on the current state of contemporary art in China?

A: This is quite a big question. I think contemporary art in China is now in a relatively good phase; it’s hot, and many institutions and collectors are very concerned contemporary art. Seen from this point, it’s a hot thing. But on the other hand, judging from the past two years, there have been very few really good works; so some people even think that we’ve reached the bottom point in contemporary Chinese art. This is rather difficult, because, for many artists, they really need to sell their works; while the social temptation is just too strong. Before, people would still care about how to produce good works and they would care about the academic side of things. Now, people talk about nothing but auctions, auction sale prices, and the market.

Q: Please describe what your art is mainly concerned with.

A: I think my work is mostly about the relationship between neighbors in residential quarters in old Beijing, the changes in the city, and learning about interpersonal relationship through the observation of these changes. There are so many artists in Beijing, but not many local professional artists. As a professional artist in Beijing, I‘m not saying I want to be an international artist. Living in Beijing, with all the surroundings, the neighbors in the Hutong alleys, the friends and relatives all around me, the street hawkers – all of these are sources of inspiration for my work. I have emotions towards all of them, so I see things under this context when working on my art.

Q: You care about relationship with the surroundings. Then, how is the interaction between your work and the audience?

A: I don’t even know. Even though I’ve worked so many years in Beijing, I feel that Beijing natives who have seen my work are quite few; the ones who really come to see my work are the persons in art circle. For example, when I do indoor or outdoor installation, the Beijing natives see them as decoration project. So I always feel like I’m doing decoration project whenever I start an installation piece. I have finished many related works in Beijing, but I think their impact has been limited.

Q: How do you think the West is regarding all these developments in contemporary Chinese art?

A: I’ve talked to some people about this. They feel that the present phenomenon is horrible. The price for art is very high, higher than what the market can take. It’s like a stock market.

Q: You’ve emphasized the close relationship with your surroundings. As an artist, what role do you play in the society?

A: Under-privileged group. All artists basically all belong to under-privileged groups. Maybe due to the recent market hype, or the higher prices at auctions, people have started to pay attention to artists, but nobody had any such concepts before. Contemporary art had no social status in the past, and it’s only because of the market prices in the past couple of years… People all care about one thing ultimately – how much [is it] does it worth? This is the level of artistic appreciation in China today.

Q: So, from your point of view, this society actually still has a very limited acceptance of contemporary art.

A: My feeling is that contemporary Chinese art, including the entire painting profession, has always occupied a decorative position in the Chinese society. A well-to-do family needs something to decorate their house, but the wealthy owners don’t know about the value of the art works, and they don’t need to know. They have the money; they can buy the paintings. So they hold the same right of speech as the artists. Other than that, they care about nothing. I think many people have gained various kinds of benefits from all this. Songzhuang is a typical example. It was previously a very poor village. Then some artists moved there, and the village leader gradually found out them. Then this thing became an event. Yet this leader was promoting art for his career gains. Now many private collectors and collecting organizations abroad have all gone there. And now that village has expanded its influence, and then this local leader became, overnight, a member of the Chinese People’s Political Consultative Conference. When contemporary art links with certain things on the international level, it gets exciting. But do these people really care that much about culture? I think not.

I made a painting recently. I always find a topic interesting: “China symbol.” Many have debated on whether Chinese artists should deploy the “China symbol.” Its antithesis is the globalization symbol – I have no idea what that might be like; I only know of the concept. My feeling is that there is nothing wrong with the China Symbol. The Americans are flaunting their Symbol everyday, and nobody has any problem with that. Then why would you have problem with the Chinese using their own Symbol? I think I’m the kind of person who will take the China Symbol to the end. As a Chinese artist, what is your goal? To promote your own culture or to extinguish your own culture? That is the question. So I decide to do contemporary art using the most traditional Chinese methods. I painted a long scroll, about 50 meters in length, of the scenery along the Chang’an Boulevard in Beijing, recording each building alongside. The Chang’an Boulevard is about 15 kilometers in length, and I painted it at the scale of 1:300, so it turned out to be 50 meters. And at the same time, with the traditional way of ancient Chinese painting, I carved many seals, displaying the names of the Hutong alleys that have disappeared in Beijing. That is my latest work.

Q: And how did you turn it into an installation piece?

A: You can’t turn it into an installation. One of my installation pieces is one made in 2002 – a large sand table, about 100 meters; it’s roughly a model of the Second Ring Road in Beijing. I got this idea while looking at lots of apartment sales centers. They have all these models of high-rises, really beautifully made. So I made this sand table as a symbol for traps – a pit, a huge pit, where many people’s life-long savings are thrown in. I thought this trickery in the form of a sand table was really fun, so I made a sand table of the entire city of Beijing, because at that time Beijing was bidding for the 2008 Olympic Games.

In fact, I think that the government is using the “renovate and improve the citizens[living] housing conditionslogan to justify their massive scale of demolishing and rebuilding. I wrote a project plan once, in which I would evacuate all the residents from a certain Hutong alley and courtyard. I rent a building for them to stay in. Then I renovate their housing, without changing the exterior structures. And I would employ top interior designers to plan a new interior decoration. Then I invite all the residents back to their homes. So I think it is indeed possible to improve their living condition without changing their living habits. The method used by the government now is really assigned migration. In other words, the citizens are an under-privileged group. When they cannot face up to the government and the developers, they would have to move, far away. The government settles them by paying tens of thousands yuan as moving expenses, and thus throws them to the periphery of the city. I think a more ideal way of doing this is to do it as if it were a work of art – we find investors to invest some money, and then we change the living conditions of these courtyard residents completely. I used to have such a project proposal; it was something I really wanted to do at that time. If this work had been realized and had succeeded, then we’d be raising a question to the city planning committee. I thought that would be fun.

bored 无聊[wu liao]

不是消极,无聊消极,可能是一种态度社会生活上的很多事情都是这种状态,和现状,可能带有自己判断,对社会、对生活判断,但并不是什么都没有、很消极的那种,不是活不下去了的那种。比如,大众审美,就跟电视电影一样,太无聊了,没办法说,但是大家喜欢,它才能存在,就是一种很低级趣味的东西,但大家都喜欢低级趣味,不论怎么样你都无法逃脱这种低级趣味的东西。

It’s not negative. Being bored is not negative; perhaps it’s a state of being. Many things in this society are in this state, this current state. Maybe it has to do with your own judgment – on society, on life. But it’s not the state of nihility and negativity that make you not want to live anymore.

For example, popular aesthetics, just like TV and movies, is just boring beyond words. But everybody likes it. That’s why it can exist. It’s something with an extremely vulgar taste, but people like vulgarity. You can’t run away from it no matter what.

(摘自徐坦对刘仁华的访谈   Excerpt from Interview with Liu Renhua)

Interviewed: Hu Xiaoyu

Time: Afternoon, February 1, 2007

Location: Dushixin Hai’an Yayuan, Futong Xi Da Jie, Beijing

     woman female  41

女性     female  32

女性主义   feminism  4

       man   24

男性      male  18

男性艺术家   male artists   8

社会    society  38

生活(活着)  life   living    lifestyle   33

个人   personal individual    21

感觉 (觉得)  feeling     21

兴趣    interest    10

不一样(不同)  different  difference   9

责任    responsibility  9

关系   relationship    7

生命   life    5

感情(ganqing)  emotion   3

情感(qinggan) emotion emotional   4

方式   way approaches   19

自己   self own personal   13

现实   reality   3

介入   intervention involvement   7

时政 political  1

自由 freedom 1

无聊   bored   3

空虚    empty (spiritually)   2

 addicted   2

打交道  deal with      3

有意思  interesting    8

没意思  out the meaning   5

刺激    stimulation  stimulated  2

Source of keywords:

Q: Talk about your life, society, and sociality.

A: Art and life do not necessarily have so many conflicts, and you don’t have to think of it as being logical and sensible. [A ] I feel that a lot of things should be allowed to evolve naturally so that they will straighten out in the best way. I think maybe the society is choosing marginal things, things in the outer limit of social norm. I started out rejecting the society. Granted, I myself am supposed to be rejected but the strange thing is, my role as an artist has probably prompted the society to pull me back from the margin. If I were in a profession in which people are required to frequently deal with the society, I might as well get filtered out. After you gain from the society, despite your unwillingness, [it's time] you are bound to take some responsibilities, which means compromise: I begin to move closer to the society, which, in turn, offers me more. But I’m not sure about the future. First I rejected the society, maybe I’m still rejecting it a little bit now, but it’s not rejecting me, this is really subtle relationship. What I don’t know is, if one day I start to embrace the society, would it reject me then? It’s hard to tell, everything is random. I’m especially afraid of having too much contact with the society. I never work with assistant, if I have an assistant does all the work, what’s the point of living? I have to be hands-on in order to figure out the meaning of my life during that period of time. I don’t have social skills and I fear dealing with people. I had depression a while ago. If I can choose my destiny at will, I think maybe nunnery is the best for me, but I can’t. Also, like I haven’t chosen to live the life I’m having now, but I ended up like this anyway, so I was forced to accept something I rejected, after a while, I got addicted to it. This is just weird and contradictory. But I believe everything will straighten themselves out in the end, so now I just try to go with the flow and be less sensitive, letting myself being pushed by other things. I try to be passive, just sitting at home waiting, and when something comes, I work with it as long as I like it. In the very beginning, making art was a way and reason of existence for me, I felt it’s more interesting than other things. Now that I have gained some recognition, you’ll need stimulation. Because your interest wears off during the process, so you need to be stimulated in order to extend it. It’s like a trajectory which will be extended by external intervention.

Q: [Market.]Does market have any influence on your artistic creation?

A: Not interested. If someone comes to me and offers to buy my stuff, I will have to consider whether I should sell or not, and that’s it. I haven’t studied the market systematically, and I don’t really care. I’m doing [okay] with my living state for now, and that’s enough.

Q: The object of your works.

A: I think they are directly connected to my personal emotion and feeling. A large portion of them share a lot of similar things, after all they are all done by myself. But the emotional sources of each work are complicated, it’s not a simple thread. Usually, when there’s a certain point in life that touches me deeply, I would create a work based on that experience. So it’s not something could be easily explained in words, what can be say for sure is that my art works are all related to my personal life. Sometimes I’m also quite puzzled, like a while ago a male friend questioned me, he thought a lot of “female artists” – of course I never call myself that – have a narrow range of concerns: emotion, pedigree, etc. We had some serious quarrel. Speaking of myself, most of my works derive from my own life experience. If you have to accuse me of that, the only reason I can think of is that I am female, so that I’m only concerned with, work on, and interested in those stuff, all the recognizable references in my works have their roots in my personal life. I didn’t think about these in the very beginning. I don’t know what’s going on with others, but I take a look at myself and I know what’s with me. A lot of male artists say that they don’t understand my works. Without having studied the history of Chinese feminism in details, I nevertheless think that women go through a lot of development and changes in a given period of time. For instance, me and my brother are all that’s in my mum‘s mind, children and husband are all that’s in my grandma’s mind, but I feel I don’t want kids now: I don’t even understand what life is about, how can I take the responsibility of have a child? I’ve been thinking what’s the meaning of life, this is perhaps a primary driving force of my art. There has to be meaning (in my works), so I keep searching for it every day. This is a male-centric society, female artists usually have normal and objective view on male ones; the opposite is rarely true, male artists always say they don’t understand our works, there is really no surprise here. Women always choose their ways of expression passively, as the range of their life experiences is limited, so the above judgment is unequally-based. Men‘s involvement in social, political and economic issues are much deeper than women, so of course they are confident in expressing their viewpoint. Women, for sure, are not confident and afraid to talk about those topics, they can only talk about themselves and their emotion. That’s why works by female artists tend to be more personal and intimate, thus difficult for men to understand. Many of my favourite Chinese female artists are very traditional, they have inherited a lot of fundamentally ‘Chinese‘ nature. The problem is not technique but what you are trying to communicate, whether you have a complete system of your own, and whether you manage to touch upon my heart. In most cases, these feelings exist only between women and are hard to describe with words. But I can feel them, they are too personal, detailed, and trivial, they are to be felt, not thought. The society is changing, there are currently many male artists (or non-artist men) paying attention to female approaches, they begin to think about those approaches they failed to understand before. I believe things will be a lot more [different] changes fifty years from now, maybe the demographic proportion would then be in favour of women, who would have more involvement in social life. When that day comes, we can expect the adjustment of social proportion or the right of ownership.

Q: The function of the artist?

A: I don’t have the sense of responsibility, don’t know how it feels to be functioning. But I’m sure a lot of people hope to function in the society, it’s about ambition. But what kind of function? That’s hard to tell. Artists have different way of expression, or shall we say different way of existencedifferent not only from the average people, but also from each other. Those whom I would consider good, who has touched me, are usually artists that base their works upon slices of personal life. From this aspect, I think all people are the same, the difference is that they have gone through different kind of life, thus coming out with different result.

Beijing 北京[bei jing]

我觉得我自己创作主要是关注北京居民邻居之间的关系城市变化以及从城市变化中了解人与人之间的关系北京很多艺术家,但真正的北京职业艺术家不多。作为北京职业艺术家也不是想成为国际艺术家。在北京生活周围一切,那些胡同里面的邻居、周围的亲戚朋友、在街道卖东西的人,这些都是作品想法来源。我对这些都是有感情的,所以我做作品的时候就会从这个环境中来考虑问题。

I think my work is mostly about the relationship between neighbors in residential quarters in old Beijing, the changes in the city, and learning about interpersonal relationship through the observation of these changes. There are so many artists in Beijing, but not many local professional artists. As a professional artist in Beijing, I‘m not saying I want to be an international artist. Living in Beijing, with all the surroundings, the neighbors in the Hutong alleys, the friends and relatives all around me, the street hawkers – all of these are sources of inspiration for my work. I have emotions towards all of them, so I see things under this context when working on my art.

(摘自徐坦对卢思沉的访谈   Excerpt from Interview with Lu Sichen)

 

Interviewed: Lu Sichen

Time: Afternoon, Jan. 30, 2007

Location: Fansi(Fancy) Restaurant, 4th Ring Road, Beijing

社会 social     18

市场 market    11

机构 institutions  organizations   11

边缘 periphery    7

居住 housing living          5

北京 Beijing        63

邻居 neighbors      5

符号 symbol      10

中国符号 China symbol     6

胡同 Hutong  alleys      10

国家    country    5

弱势群体   under-privileged groups     7

日本    Japan      6

热门  hot  3

老百姓 citizens residents 5

环境  context  13

拍卖  auction 8

价格  price, worth   5

价值  value  8

关系  relationship  21

人际关系  interpersonal relationship   2

拆迁  demolishing and rebuilding  3

西方  the West  4

建筑  building  9

位置  status  4

装修  decoration project interior decoration  3

  circle   1

Source of keywords:

Q: Could you please first comment on the current state of contemporary art in China?

A: This is quite a big question. I think contemporary art in China is now in a relatively good phase; it’s hot, and many institutions and collectors are very concerned contemporary art. Seen from this point, it’s a hot thing. But on the other hand, judging from the past two years, there have been very few really good works; so some people even think that we’ve reached the bottom point in contemporary Chinese art. This is rather difficult, because, for many artists, they really need to sell their works; while the social temptation is just too strong. Before, people would still care about how to produce good works and they would care about the academic side of things. Now, people talk about nothing but auctions, auction sale prices, and the market.

Q: Please describe what your art is mainly concerned with.

A: I think my work is mostly about the relationship between neighbors in residential quarters in old Beijing, the changes in the city, and learning about interpersonal relationship through the observation of these changes. There are so many artists in Beijing, but not many local professional artists. As a professional artist in Beijing, I‘m not saying I want to be an international artist. Living in Beijing, with all the surroundings, the neighbors in the Hutong alleys, the friends and relatives all around me, the street hawkers – all of these are sources of inspiration for my work. I have emotions towards all of them, so I see things under this context when working on my art.

Q: You care about relationship with the surroundings. Then, how is the interaction between your work and the audience?

A: I don’t even know. Even though I’ve worked so many years in Beijing, I feel that Beijing natives who have seen my work are quite few; the ones who really come to see my work are the persons in art circle. For example, when I do indoor or outdoor installation, the Beijing natives see them as decoration project. So I always feel like I’m doing decoration project whenever I start an installation piece. I have finished many related works in Beijing, but I think their impact has been limited.

Q: How do you think the West is regarding all these developments in contemporary Chinese art?

A: I’ve talked to some people about this. They feel that the present phenomenon is horrible. The price for art is very high, higher than what the market can take. It’s like a stock market.

Q: You’ve emphasized the close relationship with your surroundings. As an artist, what role do you play in the society?

A: Under-privileged group. All artists basically all belong to under-privileged groups. Maybe due to the recent market hype, or the higher prices at auctions, people have started to pay attention to artists, but nobody had any such concepts before. Contemporary art had no social status in the past, and it’s only because of the market prices in the past couple of years… People all care about one thing ultimately – how much [is it] does it worth? This is the level of artistic appreciation in China today.

Q: So, from your point of view, this society actually still has a very limited acceptance of contemporary art.

A: My feeling is that contemporary Chinese art, including the entire painting profession, has always occupied a decorative position in the Chinese society. A well-to-do family needs something to decorate their house, but the wealthy owners don’t know about the value of the art works, and they don’t need to know. They have the money; they can buy the paintings. So they hold the same right of speech as the artists. Other than that, they care about nothing. I think many people have gained various kinds of benefits from all this. Songzhuang is a typical example. It was previously a very poor village. Then some artists moved there, and the village leader gradually found out them. Then this thing became an event. Yet this leader was promoting art for his career gains. Now many private collectors and collecting organizations abroad have all gone there. And now that village has expanded its influence, and then this local leader became, overnight, a member of the Chinese People’s Political Consultative Conference. When contemporary art links with certain things on the international level, it gets exciting. But do these people really care that much about culture? I think not.

I made a painting recently. I always find a topic interesting: “China symbol.” Many have debated on whether Chinese artists should deploy the “China symbol.” Its antithesis is the globalization symbol – I have no idea what that might be like; I only know of the concept. My feeling is that there is nothing wrong with the China Symbol. The Americans are flaunting their Symbol everyday, and nobody has any problem with that. Then why would you have problem with the Chinese using their own Symbol? I think I’m the kind of person who will take the China Symbol to the end. As a Chinese artist, what is your goal? To promote your own culture or to extinguish your own culture? That is the question. So I decide to do contemporary art using the most traditional Chinese methods. I painted a long scroll, about 50 meters in length, of the scenery along the Chang’an Boulevard in Beijing, recording each building alongside. The Chang’an Boulevard is about 15 kilometers in length, and I painted it at the scale of 1:300, so it turned out to be 50 meters. And at the same time, with the traditional way of ancient Chinese painting, I carved many seals, displaying the names of the Hutong alleys that have disappeared in Beijing. That is my latest work.

Q: And how did you turn it into an installation piece?

A: You can’t turn it into an installation. One of my installation pieces is one made in 2002 – a large sand table, about 100 meters; it’s roughly a model of the Second Ring Road in Beijing. I got this idea while looking at lots of apartment sales centers. They have all these models of high-rises, really beautifully made. So I made this sand table as a symbol for traps – a pit, a huge pit, where many people’s life-long savings are thrown in. I thought this trickery in the form of a sand table was really fun, so I made a sand table of the entire city of Beijing, because at that time Beijing was bidding for the 2008 Olympic Games.

In fact, I think that the government is using the “renovate and improve the citizens[living] housing conditionslogan to justify their massive scale of demolishing and rebuilding. I wrote a project plan once, in which I would evacuate all the residents from a certain Hutong alley and courtyard. I rent a building for them to stay in. Then I renovate their housing, without changing the exterior structures. And I would employ top interior designers to plan a new interior decoration. Then I invite all the residents back to their homes. So I think it is indeed possible to improve their living condition without changing their living habits. The method used by the government now is really assigned migration. In other words, the citizens are an under-privileged group. When they cannot face up to the government and the developers, they would have to move, far away. The government settles them by paying tens of thousands yuan as moving expenses, and thus throws them to the periphery of the city. I think a more ideal way of doing this is to do it as if it were a work of art – we find investors to invest some money, and then we change the living conditions of these courtyard residents completely. I used to have such a project proposal; it was something I really wanted to do at that time. If this work had been realized and had succeeded, then we’d be raising a question to the city planning committee. I thought that would be fun.

补贴[bu tie] subsidy

This movie requires Flash Player 9

从公司老板来说,他们是得到好处的,有房租补贴,能得到优惠政策

The employers are given rent allowance and preferential policies.

(摘自徐坦对胡薇的访谈   Excerpt from Interview with HuWei)

采访对象:胡薇(张江某设计公司设计师)

采访时间:2006年8月17日

 

亲戚 relatives 3

朋友 friends 3

艺术 art artistic 7

员工 employee 3

政策 policy 4

政策优惠 preferential policies 3

car 7

创意 creative 4

eat food 5

园区 park 5

高科技园 Hi-tech Park 3

地铁 subway metro 6

 

发展 development 1

技术 technical 2

上海人 native Shanghai citizen 2

浦西 Puxi(central Shanghai) 4

人气 popularity 1

大学 universities 1

公交 bus 2

宣传() publicizing films 1

节奏 tempo 1

商业感觉 commercial sense 1

别墅 villa 1

圈子(朋友圈) circle 2

关系 related 1

人才 gifted 2

房租补贴 rent allowance 1

特色 characteristics 1

品牌 brand 1

fast 2

 

我在张江工作是过完年一月份开始的, I started my work in Zhangjiang since January, after the Spring Festival.

我是上海人,Though I am a native Shanghai citizen,

对张江的发展我是到了这里才知道的,I had had no idea of its development until I came here.

以前我是在地铁里知道有一个叫张江高科技园的站点, All I had known is merely a subway stop named Zhangjiang Hi-tech Park.

而且只知道张江是高科技园区,I had only known Zhangjiang is a hi-tech park,

但具体张江是赶什么的我也从没来过,As to what exactly it is for I had not known for I had never been here.

不来这里工作就不会到这里来。I wouldt have be here if I had not worked here.

虽然我自己是上海人,although I am a native.

在张江我觉得空气比较好,In Zhangjiang the air is quite fresh.

之间的间距比较大,The distance between buildings are long.

如果是浦西看见前面有一栋楼,大概两分钟就能走到,In Puxi(central Shanghai) if you see a building in front of you, it usually takes a two-minute walk,

而在张江可能要走十分钟才能走到,while in Zhangjiang it could take you ten minutes,

这边感觉比较开阔一点,giving people an open view.

然后就是觉得地面的灰尘比较少,没什么纸屑,比较干净。The ground is clean with little dust or rubbish.

但是就觉得人气还不够旺,But you feel like here should be more popularity.

然后就是觉得大学之间的衔接比较多,The connection route between universities are abundant.

比较重视比如像大桥五号六号Bridge No.5 and No.6 are given emphasis.

五号是连复旦六号是连交大的。The former connects to Fudan University and the latter to Shanghai Jiao Tong University.

我觉得可能还是要多开发一些公交线路,I feel like there should be more bus routes,

浦西的人能多往张江来。encouraging more people come from Puxi.

然后张江还可以再做一些资料片宣传片,In addition, Zhangjiang needs more documentaries and publicizing films,

介绍一下张江有那些基地。to introduce the bases in it.

其实,不来张江的话,对张江是有创意文化这个概念并不是很清楚的,Actually those who have never been here know little about the concept of creative culture in Zhangjiang.

只知道张江有生物资料这块基地,but the base of bio resources.

慢慢是正大九城的兴起才知道张江有游戏产业。The e-game industry became known with the development of Zhengda City 9.

我们是做电子杂志的,We do e-magazine,

就是做文化网络出版,i.e the online cultural publishment.

早前我在出版社工作过,I used to word in a publishing house,

所以这份工作对我来说等于是把我前面两份工作的经验结合起来。so this job is a combination of my previous two working experiences.

和以前比起来,应该说有一个技术门槛,是要有技术支持的,Compared with the previous ones, it needs a technical support.

我觉得这里的节奏浦西很多,I feel the tempo here is much slower than that in Puxi,

不像在人民广场和淮海路,different from places like the Peoples Square and the Huaihai Street,

人们的步伐都是那么的,感觉什么事都急匆匆的,where people walk at a fast pace and seem always in a rush,

特别我以前的广告公司在市中心,especially downtown, where my ex ads company lies.

让人感觉城市的速度很。You can feel the high speed of the city.

但在这里我觉得有种校园的氛围,But here is a phonomenon of campus.

有种回到校园的感觉,I feel like going back to school.

而且这附近的学校也比较多,With quite a few schools nearby,

商业感觉还不是特别强。its commercial sense is not that strong,

应该说给人一种比较缓慢的感觉,giving people a feel of slowness.

如果是有子的话,能住在这里还是蛮的,It would be quite good to live here with a car.

如果有钱的话在这里买别墅还可以,or if one is rich enough to afford a villa.

比如说周末住一下,但不大可能会搬过来,One can spend the weekends here, but probably not move here,

因为一般住的话和圈子关系,for living place is related with ones circle.

比如我要搬新家,也要离我原来的居住地比较近,If I move to a new place, it would not be far away from the previous one,

和我的家人与亲戚朋友要比较近。from my family, relatives and friends.

如果住的很远,和他们的沟通就不会太方便。If I live far away, it would be difficult to communicate them.

好像外地来的人,他们也会是找一个适合他们朋友圈的地方,The non-natives also find the place proper for their group of friends,

除非在张江至少有一两个朋友,或是有亲戚在这里,unless they have at least one or two friends or relatives here.

基本上是以工作为主的。Basically most people come to work.

因为我来上班是搭的,我有邻居在易贝上班,所以我是搭他的上班,

I come by car of my neighbour, who works in E-bay.

如果是搭公交和做地铁就比较麻烦,It would be troublesome to take bus or subway,

因为我家在大华那里,for I live in Dahua,

过来要换一辆再换地铁这个路途上单程就要花一个半小时,It takes an hour and a half to transfer the bus and then the subway,

来回要三个小时。which means 3 hours per day.

在路上花很长的时间,特别在地铁里花很长时间, To spent such a long time,especialy in the subway,

对我来说是不大好忍受的,应该说是比较痛苦的。is unbearable for me, a pain indeed.

如果有,我情愿走地面上的,因为在地面上可以看到外面的风景。I prefer to go on the ground if I have a car, for the view up there.

我觉得在张江上班能够呼吸到比较好的空气,I feel in Zhangjiang we have fresh air.

而且这里绿化也比较好,眼睛也比较舒服。Eyes feel good with the green belts here.

总的来说,张江离我们的生活区太远,In a word, Zhangjiang is too far from our living place.

刚来的时候感觉离开了上海来这里工作,At the beginning I felt like I left Shanghai to work here.

就好像到了苏州这样的地方上班,上海的影子不太多。as if I was working in a place like Suzhou, with little Shanghai personality in it.

但在这里工作很理想到是没有的,But its not really ideal to work here.

因为张江的确有很多政府的支持,Although it has the support from government,

就是给这些企业一些比较好的优惠政策来吸引他们过来。which gives companies preferential policies to attract them,

但问题是如果很多配套设施没有跟上的话就不好了,it is still a problem without supporting facilities.

从公司老板来说,他们是得到好处的,有房租补贴,能得到优惠政策。The employers are given rent allowance and preferential policies,

但对于招聘员工来说条件并不是很好的。but for employees it is not that good.

一些稍微好一点的人才如果看到特别是公司没有的话就不太能招到好的人才,Some gifted applicants would not come without company regular buses.

所以对于招人来说还是有点限制的,So it is a restriction for employment,

这肯定是跟公司有关了。and of course has an effect on the company.

如果公司能给员工一些比如交通上的福利政策那还可以,It could be acceptable if the employees are given welfare commuting policy.

如果没有,而是硬生生的让浦西的人来上班,Without which, one who comes from Puxi,

每天要花三个小时在路上的确是很辛苦的。has to spend 3 hours in commuting which is such a pain.

我觉得政府的优惠政策最好能给到每一个员工的身上,I think the preferential policies should be applied to each employee.

我觉得这里的园林的感觉还不错,I feel the garden here is nice,

但是要上升到艺术的话就——,while as to the art,

好像在张江没有看到什么艺术的气息,I do not feel much art here.

我看到的只有张江的政府大楼还有浦东软件园区吧,那里的几栋楼做的还可以,Only a few building like its government building and some in the Pudong software park are not bad.

而我们这里的就没有什么特色了。There is little characteristics here.

张江的广告也很少,没什么户外广告,Not many ads here, nor the outdoor ones.

但从另外一个角度来说他没有被广告污染,这一点比较好。On one side it has not yet been contaminated by the ads, which is good,

如果是从艺术创意来讲,就如从地铁下来,but from the view of artistic creativity, down from the metro,

没有给人一个这里是创意艺术园区,这个感觉还没有。you would feel little of a park of creative art.

这里只能给人感觉离城市比较远,然后空气比较好,People only feel it far from city with fresh air,

要上升到艺术创意这个概念还需要有些改进。and more needs to be done to elevate it to the concept of artistic creativity.

如果说是科技园区的话那还可以理解,Call it a hi-tech park is acceptable,

但要说是艺术园区好像还没这个概念。but there is nothing like a artistic park.

第一我觉得空气比较好,第二需要提高他的艺术品牌,First the air is good, and secondly the art brand needs to be elevated.

还有就是张江的一些附加值,比如说他的交通还有,Then the add-ons, like the transportation and the food here,

因为我们在这里工作中午很难到东西,for we have little to eat at working noon.

我们这里有一句话Here we have a saying,

“你在市中心上班,肚子饿了可以到东西, If you work downtown, you can eat when you are hungry,

在张江肚子饿了是利于减肥”。while in Zhangjiang you are on diet.

因为有钱也买不到东西,for money can not buy food here.

点东西要走很远,要到地铁站,You have to walk to the subway stop to find foods,

我们这里走过去要二十分钟的路程,which takes us twenty minutes from here.

我们都懒的走这些路了,基本上就这样了。Usually we are too lazy and just let it be.

别墅[bie shu] villa

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1.张江这边有很多别墅,除非以后年纪大了,达到一定的程度,有了相当的经济实力,可以来住这里的别墅,现在看来不大可能住这边。

In Zhangjiang there are many villas. But we could not afford them unless we become quite well off in future. Now it seems totally impossible to live here.

(摘自徐坦对秦晋的访谈   Excerpt from Interview with Qin Jin)

采访对象:秦晋张江某IT公司职员)

采访时间:2006816

生活气息 (sense of)living life 6

公司 company 7

do make 10

商业 business 3

far remote 6

new 3

car 3

创业 entrepreneurship 3

按摩 massage 1

做脸 facial 1

打扮 dress 2

国际 international 2

外来人 non-natives 2

辛苦 hardworking 2

别墅 villa 2

发展 develop 2

circl 2

活动 activity 1

house apartment 2

逛街 shopping 1

经济实力 economical strength 2

媒体 media 2

市场 market 2

销售 sell 1

环境 surrounding 2

 

张江是个工作的地方,它是开发区,Zhangjiang is a place for working. It is a development zone after all.

冠以开发区的名头,让人感觉是创业的地方,The title itself feels like a place of entrepreneurship,

辛苦的地方,不是生活的地方,a place of hardworking instead of living.

没有生活气息商业和各方面都不方便,There is no sense of living here.Inconvenient commercially and in all other ways.

地铁晚了回不来,除非自己有,You have to be back early to take the subway, unless you have your car.

即使自己有也要开很,Even with a car you have to drive a long distance.

张江这边有很多别墅,In Zhangjiang there are many villas.

除非以后年纪大了,达到一定的程度,有了相当的经济实力,可以来住这里的别墅

But we could not afford them unless we become quite well off in future.

现在看来不大可能住这边。Now it seems totally impossible to live here.

上班确实要,It’s indeed a long way to go to work.

一开始认为很,后来和上海的朋友聊天,But later I talked to my native friends

发现他们从小就是这么的,and found them commute like this since childhood.

比如,他们有可能家住张江,而学校却在复旦大学那边,For example, they could live in Zhangjiang, but go to school near Fudan University,

因为都要读好学校,for they prefer good schools.

每天要在路上2-3个小时,从很小开始,Since they were little they have been spent 2 to 3 hours in commuting per day.

所以我现在觉得不算太,So now I think it’s not that far away.

就近工作当然好,Of couse it would be perfect to work nearby,

但是没有那么两全其美的事,but that is too good to be true.

 

这是一个让人比较能够集中思想的地方,But this is a place for people to easily concentrate.

在这里,人觉得比较塌实,People are down to earth here.

这里不象徐家汇南京西路物质诱惑特别多 Different from Xujiahui or Nanjing West Road,   whick is full of material distractions

每天要逛街按摩做脸,很多活动,where you do shopping, massage or facial every day.Plenty of things to do.

在这边,你来公司上班,无论是大公司国际公司,还是小公司,Here you come to work, no matter in a big international company or a small one,

这份事的时候,你可以专注地去,you can concentrate on your job.

这边的人的气质,这边有很多外来的人,The character of people here, among whom many are non-natives,

整个这里的气氛,小区的气氛,工业园的环境,让人觉得清,and the overall phenomenon of the zone are refreshing,

不会让人觉得太浮华,是工作的好地方。Not showy. A great place for work.

 

女孩子都有两种理想生活,Each girl has two ideal life styles.

一是她羡慕的;另一是她想得到的,One is what she is envious of, the other is what she wants.

当然这两种都不是她现在所拥有的,Of course neither is what she is having.

作为羡慕的方式,女孩子大都喜欢呆在大城市,As for the admiring, girls perfer big cities.

时间,穿的打扮得美,不太劳累的事情,Have spare time, dress themselves gorgeously, and do easy job.

这是一种生活方式,基本上可以随心所欲,It’s a life they can do basically whatever they want,

又可以照顾家庭,又能够自己的事情。can take care of their family and have their own career as well.

这就是她们比较羡慕的方式。This is the life girls envious of.

如果走运的话,能这样生活最好。It would be perfect if they are lucky enough to live such a life.

另外的方式,就是比较接近自己经过努力就能到的,The other is a life they can possibly access through effort.

首先有个,再有,a life with a home, their own apartment and car,

有稳定的公司工作, a stable position in company,

还有很好的一朋友家庭和睦。plus a group of friends and happy family life.

 

如果媒体市场销售工作,If you work with media, marketing or sales,

就需要在商业工作,you need to work in a business field,

能够接受很多和工作相关的外界刺激,accessable to lots of outside incentives related with your work,

比如广告,各种各样广告形式,such as advertisements in various forms.

还有各种业态总是最先出现在商业。And new business trends always initiate in the business zone.

但是如果你IT制造业或是其他,But if you do IT, manufacture or others.

在张江则是最好的,这边的配备也是很好的。Zhangjiang would be an ideal place, with all the neat facilities.

 

第一, ,代表着不方便,1. remote, which means inconvenience,

2,很积极, 2. highly active,

3,活力,在这个地方总能看到公司,3. energetic. We can always see new companies,

的人从全国各地,世界各地来此创业,and entrepreneurs are coming from all over the country or even the world,

4, 发展 。4. developing.

边缘[bian yuan] verge

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1.你觉得在艺术上有没有地域中心边缘之分?

Speaking of art, do you think there is a distinction between geographical center and margin?

(摘自徐坦对艾未未的访谈   Excerpt from Interview with Ai Weiwei)

 

2.现在应该没有以前那么封闭了吧,慢慢地你发现可以通过网络,可以每天睡觉都不用管什么中心边缘了。

I think it is less closed than before. Eventually you’ll see that, with the aid of the internet, you don’t have to be concerned about the problem to centre as opposed to fringe.

(摘自徐坦对郑国谷的访谈   Excerpt from Interview with Zheng Guogu)

采访对象:艾东明

采访时间:2007年1月31日下午

采访地点:于北京草场地艾家

do” engage in 25

可能 maybe possibility impossible perhaps may 21

社会 society social 19

问题 problem question 17

兴趣 fascinated interested uninterested interest 12

个人 individual 12

方式 ways approaches 10

市场 market 9

价值 value 7

政治的 political  1

国家 country  state  4

自由 freedom  free 7

个人表达 individual expression

地下 underground

民主 democratic  2

circle 3

money 5

时代 (information/Internet) age 5

play 3

资金 capital 1

poor poverty 4

弱智 retarded 2

face 3

Q:先请艾老师说下你对中国当代艺术现状的看法或印象。

A:我不能装作很了解这个事,虽然我一直在北京,经常参与一些策展,我们有艺术文件仓库,有很多艺术的朋友,但是我还不是很了解这个东西,但这两年好像很热闹,而前几年好像都没什么人去搭理它,所以我觉得好像它是一会儿发高烧,一会儿发冷的状态,我觉得可能像是这样,因为现代艺术这一块实际上时间也是很短的,中国实际上虽然有它的现代生活,但这个现代生活在很大程度上是已经由政治的经济的特征定下来的,是一个已经是什么样的体制下的国家了,那么这种个人表达自由政治背景生活条件,以及文化艺术社会中的作用可能,我觉得基本上都是已经限定下来的了,那么通常所称的当代艺术,实际上它能浮出水面,也只是近五、六年的事情,而之前很多人了很多事情实际上都是处在一种半地下的状态的,就是说只是一个很小的,没有被公众话语所关注,对社会的影响实际上也只是在非常小的范围内的,一旦浮出来之后,它主要是在国外的很多展览报导甚至拍卖,好像搞得很热闹,但是这些并没有涉及到这些作品生存环境和所表达的社会形态含义,这些问题探讨并不是很多的,所以它还是一个非常奇怪的结构,但是我们也不能说任何结构是否就是合理的,比如说有的是树,有的是藤,有的是自然界生猛的动物,有的是寄生的动物,而它们都有其自身的合理性,所以尽管中国当代艺术它不是主动有意识地去和这个社会建立某种关系,但是实际上它也反映了过去这几十年的一些问题

Q:你觉得它反映的是一些什么问题呢?

A:反映了中国近几十年中的哲学美学伦理学的彻底解体,新的甚至探讨的可能都还没有建立,因为这个社会仍然是处在大面积的或者主体地否认事实,或者说不承认一些基本的事实,在很多问题上几乎是没有争论的可能,它离民主社会还是很远,虽然它有极大的自由,但这种自由只是建立在旧体制瓦解上的自由,是没有能力控制下的自由,并不是一种很主动的自由,这些都给艺术一些特征

Q:那你怎样看待现在公众对当代艺术的接受方面?

A:我觉得没有什么真正的接受,它只是成为时尚的另外一个门类,杂志、报纸谈到这些问题的时候,你可以看到,它就只能三句五句的谈,但没有一句能够谈到点子上,也不能够深入下去,我觉得这个事儿挺可怜的,就有点像弱智了,中国当代艺术真是扮演了一个弱智角色,当然它有很好的艺术家,有从开始到现在还在很有意思的事情的艺术家,但是这些艺术家,他们探讨的方式都没有得到主流社会认识,甚至连了解也谈不上,现在基本上就是乱七八糟的吧。

Q:那你觉得你参与策划展览之类的活动能否对这种乱七八糟的状况有所作用呢?

A:现在中国展览很多,但是一点帮助和意义都没有,它变成了一些摊贩,就是说像你经常看到的一些摆摊的,一条街卖一样的东西,互相叫板,互相竞争,我觉得这个是为市场设计的,跟艺术没什么关系,完全是为市场设计的,那么这些展览,你仔细看看这些策展人,有几个是像样的?都是心怀鬼胎,怀着各种各样的目的,我觉得这是中国的学术界和知识分子最让人看不起的一点,就是总体不要,整个儿就是彻底的公开张扬不要,这也是少有的一件事,但是啊,就像中国人说的志短,说得太准了,“”还好听点,实际上就是人都很“”了,没什么问题,但它只是一个借口

Q:你刚才讲到市场,那请谈下你对艺术市场的看法。

A:什么东西都能卖,艺术这么高雅的东西当然也能,因为能卖就主要是为了装饰有的家,那么艺术品就成了一个交易的货品的东西了,这个本来挺正常的,只是这个比例有多大?就是在整个大的文化环境当中,它是否变成了唯一问题,是否脆弱到只要它一出现,其他东西就都消失了?我觉得这个是中国的一个很大的问题,当然……我自己这样看,这个事闹成这样挺好笑的,因为好像你这个事的理由都变了,这个东西让你生活的原则和理由都发生变化了,最后就变成好像转换成另外某种价值了,太多人谈论关心这个问题了,如果你不是一个艺术家,只是一个投机商,这个就很正常了,如果你还是一个创作的人,或者说你本来是一个觉得有话才去从事这个行业,觉得对一种方式兴趣——而不是说简单的财、资金和地位可以替换你的那些最早的东西,就不正常和奇怪了。现在我感觉好像都在谈这一块,是挺烦的一件事,市场本身就是不正常的东西,从股票到名牌定的价格,市场本身是无可非议的,一个东西卖五分和卖五千块和卖五万块都是无可非议的,只是说在这个市场背后,这个产品本身的其他价值是否被这个市场价格给彻底冲淡了?这是一个问题

Q:那你自己感兴趣的其实是什么?

A:说老实话,我没有什么兴趣的事,比如我并不是说不喜欢商业这一块或者说对别的什么东西感兴趣,我确实没有太多兴趣的事,可能是我还是比较被动吧,当然总的来说,艺术是我比较兴趣的一个行当,本来我比较感兴趣是因为这里的人比较不功利,比较还有自己的特征,还活得你是你我是我的,但是现在呢?你可以发现,这个艺术的人跟隔壁卖菜的农民没什么差别,上市之前抖点水啊,称的时候再抖两下,我觉得都差不多,这是让人觉得挺无聊的一件事,其实我才不在意这件事,我也不搭理它,比如这个国家是死是活,我也不太在乎,只不过你问到这个问题,就像你问我今天的天气如何,什么沙尘暴啊或者刮风啊,但是这种事又不是你能控制的,这只是国家的一个现状

Q:讲一讲你的博客吧。

A博客很有意思,待会儿就把给你拍的照片放上去,然后很多的人我也都不认识,反正他们一点击就看到了,我就觉得这个是很直接现实同时又是很幻觉的一个事情,所以我就一直在这个事。

Q:就是说它是一个你传播你自己信息的途径?

A:我觉得信息时代是人类遇到的最的一个时代,是第一次给所谓的自由个人意志技术上提供了可能,在这之前,人类一直是在黑暗当中或者是在独木桥上,或者是在一个必由之路上,那么这个信息时代第一次让人有可能自己或者和愿意一起的人,这在过去是没有的,所以我觉得我们应该是很有兴致和很有机会进去这么一种状态,就是说它有几点是非常重要的:自由地表达个人方式。这听上去虽然很俗套,但是这个是很重要的事情,包括交流可能,包括把社会的力量重新地施以影响吸收运用可能,这是很了不起的一件事情。

Q:你觉得在艺术上有没有地域的中心边缘之分?

A:我觉得不存在,尤其是在这个信息时代网络时代就更不存在了,这是人类第一次有机会和有可能把这个传统价值,即所谓的传统的原始、中心和权利彻底瓦解,这个可能性确实是人类挣扎了很多年以后突然蹦出来的,这是一个很了不起的东西。

变[bian (gai bian)] change

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1. 这个社会也在改变,现在有很多艺术家,或除去男性艺术家以外的一些男性,开始关注女性的一些方式,开始考虑自己不能理解的一些女性的方式;我觉得50年以后肯定有更大的改变,可能人口比例也变得更有利于女性,女性的关注和介入可能会更多,这个社会的比例或者占有的权利就会相对调整

The society is changing, there are currently many male artists (or men) paying attention to female approaches, they begin to think about those approaches they failed to understand before. I believe things will be a lot more changes fifty years from now, maybe the demographic proportion would then be in favour of women, who would have more involvement in social life. When that day comes, we can expect the adjustment of social proportion or the right of ownership.

(摘自徐坦对胡晓媛的访谈   Excerpt from Interview with Hu Xiaoyuan)

 

2. 我觉得在不改变他们生活习性的情况下来改变居住条件,是有可能的。

So I think it is indeed possible to improve their living condition without changing their living habits.

(摘自徐坦对卢昊的访谈   Excerpt from Interview with Lu Hao)

采访对象:卢思沉

采访时间:2007130日下午

采访地点:于北京四环辅路梵思西餐厅

社会 social 18

市场 market 11

机构 institutions organizations 11

边缘 periphery 7

居住 housing living 5

北京 Beijing 63

邻居 neighbors 5

符号 symbol 10

中国符号 China symbol 6

胡同 Hutong alleys 10

 

国家 country 5

弱势群体 under-privileged groups 7

日本 Japan 6

 

热门 hot 3

老百姓 citizens residents 5

环境 context 13

拍卖 auction 8

价格 price, worth 5

价值 value 8

关系 relationship 21

人际关系 interpersonal relationship 2

拆迁 demolishing and rebuilding 3

西方 the West 4

建筑 building 9

位置 status 4

装修 decoration project interior decoration 3

circle 1

 

Q:先请卢老师谈一下你对现在中国当代艺术发展状况的一些看法。

A:这问题挺大的。我觉得现在中国当代艺术发展正处在一个比较好时期,很热门,很多机构收藏家都非常关注当代艺术。从这一点来讲,它是一个比较事情。但是就这两年来看,作品反而出得,不多,有人就觉得现在是中国当代艺术最低潮的时候,

这要做到也挺难的,因为我觉得,对于很多艺术家来说,他们需要卖画社会诱惑力太了。以前大家还关注怎么去制作一件好作品,关注学术;现在讨论的全是拍卖拍卖价格的问题、市场问题

Q:谈一下你的创作主要关注的东西。

A:我觉得我自己创作主要是关注北京居民邻居之间的关系城市变化以及从城市变化中了解人与人之间的关系北京很多艺术家,但真正的北京职业艺术家不多。作为北京职业艺术家也不是想成为国际艺术家。在北京生活周围一切,那些胡同里面的邻居、周围的亲戚朋友、在街道卖东西的人,这些都是作品想法来源。我对这些都是有感情的,所以我做作品的时候就会从这个环境中来考虑问题。

Q:你很重视跟周围环境接触的关系,那你觉得你的作品跟观众之间的互动是一个怎样的情况?

A:我也不知道。虽然我在北京了这么多年,但我觉得真正北京,就是看过作品北京老百姓,真正看作品的还是面的。例如我做室内或者室外装置,他们把它当成是装修理解,所以我觉得做装置开始就像是装修的,我在北京做了很多跟这个有关的作品,但我觉得它的影响力还是很有限的。

Q:你觉得西方那边是怎样看待中国当代艺术的发展的?

A:我也跟一些人聊过,他们觉得现在这种现象可怕的,现在作品价格很高的,高出市场承受能力,这就有点像股市

Q:之前你强调了你和周边生活环境的密切关系,那么作为艺术家来讲,你觉得自己在社会扮演什么样的角色

A:弱势群体艺术家基本上都是弱势群体。现在可能因为市场炒的原因,或价格拍卖了,有的人就开始关注艺术家,但以前根本没有谁有这个概念当代艺术以前没有什么位置,不过这两年是因为价格原因……最终大家都关心一个问题,就是价值是多少?这个也就是目前中国对艺术欣赏水平的程度了。

Q:那么从你的角度来看,其实这个社会环境对当代艺术的接受还是很有限的。

A:我的感觉就是,中国当代艺术,包括整个绘画行业中国这个社会里始终处在一个装饰性位置生活条件好家庭需要装饰画,但对于有钱人来讲,他不知道价值,他也不需要了解,他有钱,能买画,就掌握跟艺术家讲话的一个话语权,除此之外,他不关心别的问题。……我感觉就是,很多人里面给自己获取了不同的利益,比如像宋庄就是最典型的例子,那以前就是一个很穷,一些艺术家去了,这个里的领导就慢慢地发现了他们,这个事就成一个了,但这个领导是从自己想升官这个角度发展艺术的,现在就有很多国外收藏家收藏机构都去那了,然后慢慢地那个地方影响就不断扩大了,然后这个领导一下子就成了全国政协委员了……当代艺术国际上某些事挂在一起的时候,这事就挺有意思了……但是这些人是真的那么关心文化吗?我觉得不是

最近画了一张。我觉得有个话题挺有意思的,叫“中国符号”,很多人谈论中国艺术家应不应该用“中国符号”这个问题,它相对的是全球化的符号——我也不知道全球化符号大概是什么东西,就只有一个概念。我的感觉是,中国符号没什么不好的,……美国人每天到处都在他们的符号,也没有问题,那为什么中国人用符号就有问题呢?我觉得就是有志于中国符号进行到底的那种人……作为一个中国艺术家,目的是什么?是张扬自己的文化还是消灭自己的文化?这是一个问题。所以我想用最传统中国方式去做当代艺术。我画了一幅长卷,这长卷大概有五十米长,是长安街的街景,把长安街每一个建筑都同时记录在里边,因为长安街大概是十五公里长,我是按1300的比例做,就正好五十米长。同时我按中国画以前方式——我了好多个图章,那些图章都是北京消失胡同名字。这就是我最近做的东西。

Q:你怎样把它转换成装置?

A:这个作品转换不成装置。我的一个装置作品就是2002做的一个很沙盘100左右,是北京二环的一个大致的模型,当时做这个作品的想法,就是看了很多售楼处,售楼处到处都是盖的高楼模型,做得特别漂亮,我做了沙盘,沙盘实际上就是一个陷阱、一个,巨大的一个坑,很多人一辈子辛辛苦苦挣的可能就全进那个坑里了,我想沙盘这种骗人方式好玩,就按照它做了一个北京沙盘,因为当时北京申办2008奥运会

其实我觉得,政府就是打着“改造改善老百姓居住条件”的口号来进行大面积的拆迁。我以前曾经做过一个作品方案,就是想先胡同里面大杂院里的老百姓全部都请出来,给他们一个楼房,然后我们把院子重新装修,在外结构不动情况下,请很好的室内设计师做室内的规划设计,然后再把他们请回来,再到他们自己每个人的。我觉得在不改变他们生活习性的情况下来改变居住条件,是有可能的。现在政府的这种做法,实际上是派遣性迁移,就是说老百姓是一个弱势群体,他们没有办法去面对政府和开发商时,就只能搬家,搬得很远,政府给他们几万块十几万块拆迁,从此就把他们城市边缘去了,我觉得相对理想化一点的方式就是能不能按做作品方式,我们一个投资商来投一笔,把杂院里的老百姓居住条件全部改变。我曾经就有过这样的一个方案,是我当时一直想做的一个作品,如果这个作品有被实施,它最后成功了,那我们实际上就是给规委提出一个问题,我觉得这挺好玩的。

保障[bao zhang] guarantee,ensure

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在中国,有钱的人最直接的体现就是要有资产地产不动产是中国人表现富有最直接的一方面。还有很重要的一方面,就是中国还没有很大的信誉体系构造前提下,那么能够体现人最基本的信誉保障就是房产

In China, the representation of richness is property, land, and estate. The clearest sign of fortune. Being so long in the business, I feel like that Even china is in a vivid discussion about real estate bubble, I still think that the Chinese real estate just has started. Another point, China still lacks a well-structured credit system; in this case, real estate stands for one’s guarantee.

(摘自徐坦对艾伟的访谈   Excerpt from Interview with Ai Wei)

采访对象:艾东明

采访时间:2007131日下午

采访地点:于北京草场地艾家

do” engage in 25

可能 maybe possibility impossible perhaps may 21

社会 society social 19

问题 problem question 17

兴趣 fascinated interested uninterested interest 12

个人 individual 12

方式 ways approaches 10

市场 market 9

价值 value 7

政治的 political 1

国家 country state 4

自由 freedom free 7

个人表达 individual expression

地下 underground

民主 democratic 2

circle 3

money 5

时代 (information/Internet) age 5

play 3

资金 capital 1

poor poverty 4

弱智 retarded 2

face 3

Q:先请艾老师说下你对中国当代艺术现状的看法或印象。

A:我不能装作很了解这个事,虽然我一直在北京,经常参与一些策展,我们有艺术文件仓库,有很多艺术的朋友,但是我还不是很了解这个东西,但这两年好像很热闹,而前几年好像都没什么人去搭理它,所以我觉得好像它是一会儿发高烧,一会儿发冷的状态,我觉得可能像是这样,因为现代艺术这一块实际上时间也是很短的,中国实际上虽然有它的现代生活,但这个现代生活在很大程度上是已经由政治的经济的特征定下来的,是一个已经是什么样的体制下的国家了,那么这种个人表达自由政治背景生活条件,以及文化艺术社会中的作用可能,我觉得基本上都是已经限定下来的了,那么通常所称的当代艺术,实际上它能浮出水面,也只是近五、六年的事情,而之前很多人了很多事情实际上都是处在一种地下的状态的,就是说只是一个很小的,没有被公众话语所关注,对社会的影响实际上也只是在非常小的范围内的,一旦浮出来之后,它主要是在国外的很多展览报导甚至拍卖,好像搞得很热闹,但是这些并没有涉及到这些作品生存环境和所表达的社会形态含义,这些问题探讨并不是很多的,所以它还是一个非常奇怪的结构,但是我们也不能说任何结构是否就是合理的,比如说有的是树,有的是藤,有的是自然界生猛的动物,有的是寄生的动物,而它们都有其自身的合理性,所以尽管中国当代艺术它不是主动有意识地去和这个社会建立某种关系,但是实际上它也反映了过去这几十年的一些问题

Q:你觉得它反映的是一些什么问题呢?

A:反映了中国近几十年中的哲学美学伦理学的彻底解体,新的甚至探讨的可能都还没有建立,因为这个社会仍然是处在大面积的或者主体地否认事实,或者说不承认一些基本的事实,在很多问题上几乎是没有争论的可能,它离民主社会还是很远,虽然它有极大的自由,但这种自由只是建立在旧体制瓦解上的自由,是没有能力控制下的自由,并不是一种很主动的自由,这些都给艺术一些特征

Q:那你怎样看待现在公众对当代艺术的接受方面?

A:我觉得没有什么真正的接受,它只是成为时尚的另外一个门类,杂志、报纸谈到这些问题的时候,你可以看到,它就只能三句五句的谈,但没有一句能够谈到点子上,也不能够深入下去,我觉得这个事儿挺可怜的,就有点像弱智了,中国当代艺术真是扮演了一个弱智角色,当然它有很好的艺术家,有从开始到现在还在很有意思的事情的艺术家,但是这些艺术家,他们探讨的方式都没有得到主流社会认识,甚至连了解也谈不上,现在基本上就是乱七八糟的吧。

Q:那你觉得你参与策划展览之类的活动能否对这种乱七八糟的状况有所作用呢?

A:现在中国展览很多,但是一点帮助和意义都没有,它变成了一些摊贩,就是说像你经常看到的一些摆摊的,一条街卖一样的东西,互相叫板,互相竞争,我觉得这个是为市场设计的,跟艺术没什么关系,完全是为市场设计的,那么这些展览,你仔细看看这些策展人,有几个是像样的?都是心怀鬼胎,怀着各种各样的目的,我觉得这是中国的学术界和知识分子最让人看不起的一点,就是总体不要,整个儿就是彻底的公开张扬不要,这也是少有的一件事,但是啊,就像中国人说的志短,说得太准了,“”还好听点,实际上就是人都很“”了,没什么问题,但它只是一个借口

Q:你刚才讲到市场,那请谈下你对艺术市场的看法。

A:什么东西都能卖,艺术这么高雅的东西当然也能,因为能卖就主要是为了装饰有的家,那么艺术品就成了一个交易的货品的东西了,这个本来挺正常的,只是这个比例有多大?就是在整个大的文化环境当中,它是否变成了唯一问题,是否脆弱到只要它一出现,其他东西就都消失了?我觉得这个是中国的一个很大的问题,当然……我自己这样看,这个事闹成这样挺好笑的,因为好像你这个事的理由都变了,这个东西让你生活的原则和理由都发生变化了,最后就变成好像转换成另外某种价值了,太多人谈论关心这个问题了,如果你不是一个艺术家,只是一个投机商,这个就很正常了,如果你还是一个创作的人,或者说你本来是一个觉得有话才去从事这个行业,觉得对一种方式兴趣——而不是说简单的财、资金和地位可以替换你的那些最早的东西,就不正常和奇怪了。现在我感觉好像都在谈这一块,是挺烦的一件事,市场本身就是不正常的东西,从股票到名牌定的价格,市场本身是无可非议的,一个东西卖五分和卖五千块和卖五万块都是无可非议的,只是说在这个市场背后,这个产品本身的其他价值是否被这个市场价格给彻底冲淡了?这是一个问题

Q:那你自己感兴趣的其实是什么?

A:说老实话,我没有什么兴趣的事,比如我并不是说不喜欢商业这一块或者说对别的什么东西感兴趣,我确实没有太多兴趣的事,可能是我还是比较被动吧,当然总的来说,艺术是我比较兴趣的一个行当,本来我比较感兴趣是因为这里的人比较不功利,比较还有自己的特征,还活得你是你我是我的,但是现在呢?你可以发现,这个艺术的人跟隔壁卖菜的农民没什么差别,上市之前抖点水啊,称的时候再抖两下,我觉得都差不多,这是让人觉得挺无聊的一件事,其实我才不在意这件事,我也不搭理它,比如这个国家是死是活,我也不太在乎,只不过你问到这个问题,就像你问我今天的天气如何,什么沙尘暴啊或者刮风啊,但是这种事又不是你能控制的,这只是国家的一个现状

Q:讲一讲你的博客吧。

A博客很有意思,待会儿就把给你拍的照片放上去,然后很多的人我也都不认识,反正他们一点击就看到了,我就觉得这个是很直接现实同时又是很幻觉的一个事情,所以我就一直在这个事。

Q:就是说它是一个你传播你自己信息的途径?

A:我觉得信息时代是人类遇到的最的一个时代,是第一次给所谓的自由个人意志技术上提供了可能,在这之前,人类一直是在黑暗当中或者是在独木桥上,或者是在一个必由之路上,那么这个信息时代第一次让人有可能自己或者和愿意一起的人,这在过去是没有的,所以我觉得我们应该是很有兴致和很有机会进去这么一种状态,就是说它有几点是非常重要的:自由地表达个人方式。这听上去虽然很俗套,但是这个是很重要的事情,包括交流可能,包括把社会的力量重新地施以影响吸收运用可能,这是很了不起的一件事情。

Q:你觉得在艺术上有没有地域的中心边缘之分?

A:我觉得不存在,尤其是在这个信息时代网络时代就更不存在了,这是人类第一次有机会和有可能把这个传统价值,即所谓的传统的原始、中心和权利彻底瓦解,这个可能性确实是人类挣扎了很多年以后突然蹦出来的,这是一个很了不起的东西。

采访对象:艾东明

采访时间:2007131日下午

采访地点:于北京草场地艾家

do” engage in 25

可能 maybe possibility impossible perhaps may 21

社会 society social 19

问题 problem question 17

兴趣 fascinated interested uninterested interest 12

个人 individual 12

方式 ways approaches 10

市场 market 9

价值 value 7

政治的 political 1

国家 country state 4

自由 freedom free 7

个人表达 individual expression

地下 underground

民主 democratic 2

circle 3

money 5

时代 (information/Internet) age 5

play 3

资金 capital 1

poor poverty 4

弱智 retarded 2

face 3

Q:先请艾老师说下你对中国当代艺术现状的看法或印象。

A:我不能装作很了解这个事,虽然我一直在北京,经常参与一些策展,我们有艺术文件仓库,有很多艺术的朋友,但是我还不是很了解这个东西,但这两年好像很热闹,而前几年好像都没什么人去搭理它,所以我觉得好像它是一会儿发高烧,一会儿发冷的状态,我觉得可能像是这样,因为现代艺术这一块实际上时间也是很短的,中国实际上虽然有它的现代生活,但这个现代生活在很大程度上是已经由政治的经济的特征定下来的,是一个已经是什么样的体制下的国家了,那么这种个人表达自由政治背景生活条件,以及文化艺术社会中的作用可能,我觉得基本上都是已经限定下来的了,那么通常所称的当代艺术,实际上它能浮出水面,也只是近五、六年的事情,而之前很多人了很多事情实际上都是处在一种地下的状态的,就是说只是一个很小的,没有被公众话语所关注,对社会的影响实际上也只是在非常小的范围内的,一旦浮出来之后,它主要是在国外的很多展览报导甚至拍卖,好像搞得很热闹,但是这些并没有涉及到这些作品生存环境和所表达的社会形态含义,这些问题探讨并不是很多的,所以它还是一个非常奇怪的结构,但是我们也不能说任何结构是否就是合理的,比如说有的是树,有的是藤,有的是自然界生猛的动物,有的是寄生的动物,而它们都有其自身的合理性,所以尽管中国当代艺术它不是主动有意识地去和这个社会建立某种关系,但是实际上它也反映了过去这几十年的一些问题

Q:你觉得它反映的是一些什么问题呢?

A:反映了中国近几十年中的哲学美学伦理学的彻底解体,新的甚至探讨的可能都还没有建立,因为这个社会仍然是处在大面积的或者主体地否认事实,或者说不承认一些基本的事实,在很多问题上几乎是没有争论的可能,它离民主社会还是很远,虽然它有极大的自由,但这种自由只是建立在旧体制瓦解上的自由,是没有能力控制下的自由,并不是一种很主动的自由,这些都给艺术一些特征

Q:那你怎样看待现在公众对当代艺术的接受方面?

A:我觉得没有什么真正的接受,它只是成为时尚的另外一个门类,杂志、报纸谈到这些问题的时候,你可以看到,它就只能三句五句的谈,但没有一句能够谈到点子上,也不能够深入下去,我觉得这个事儿挺可怜的,就有点像弱智了,中国当代艺术真是扮演了一个弱智角色,当然它有很好的艺术家,有从开始到现在还在很有意思的事情的艺术家,但是这些艺术家,他们探讨的方式都没有得到主流社会认识,甚至连了解也谈不上,现在基本上就是乱七八糟的吧。

Q:那你觉得你参与策划展览之类的活动能否对这种乱七八糟的状况有所作用呢?

A:现在中国展览很多,但是一点帮助和意义都没有,它变成了一些摊贩,就是说像你经常看到的一些摆摊的,一条街卖一样的东西,互相叫板,互相竞争,我觉得这个是为市场设计的,跟艺术没什么关系,完全是为市场设计的,那么这些展览,你仔细看看这些策展人,有几个是像样的?都是心怀鬼胎,怀着各种各样的目的,我觉得这是中国的学术界和知识分子最让人看不起的一点,就是总体不要,整个儿就是彻底的公开张扬不要,这也是少有的一件事,但是啊,就像中国人说的志短,说得太准了,“”还好听点,实际上就是人都很“”了,没什么问题,但它只是一个借口

Q:你刚才讲到市场,那请谈下你对艺术市场的看法。

A:什么东西都能卖,艺术这么高雅的东西当然也能,因为能卖就主要是为了装饰有的家,那么艺术品就成了一个交易的货品的东西了,这个本来挺正常的,只是这个比例有多大?就是在整个大的文化环境当中,它是否变成了唯一问题,是否脆弱到只要它一出现,其他东西就都消失了?我觉得这个是中国的一个很大的问题,当然……我自己这样看,这个事闹成这样挺好笑的,因为好像你这个事的理由都变了,这个东西让你生活的原则和理由都发生变化了,最后就变成好像转换成另外某种价值了,太多人谈论关心这个问题了,如果你不是一个艺术家,只是一个投机商,这个就很正常了,如果你还是一个创作的人,或者说你本来是一个觉得有话才去从事这个行业,觉得对一种方式兴趣——而不是说简单的财、资金和地位可以替换你的那些最早的东西,就不正常和奇怪了。现在我感觉好像都在谈这一块,是挺烦的一件事,市场本身就是不正常的东西,从股票到名牌定的价格,市场本身是无可非议的,一个东西卖五分和卖五千块和卖五万块都是无可非议的,只是说在这个市场背后,这个产品本身的其他价值是否被这个市场价格给彻底冲淡了?这是一个问题

Q:那你自己感兴趣的其实是什么?

A:说老实话,我没有什么兴趣的事,比如我并不是说不喜欢商业这一块或者说对别的什么东西感兴趣,我确实没有太多兴趣的事,可能是我还是比较被动吧,当然总的来说,艺术是我比较兴趣的一个行当,本来我比较感兴趣是因为这里的人比较不功利,比较还有自己的特征,还活得你是你我是我的,但是现在呢?你可以发现,这个艺术的人跟隔壁卖菜的农民没什么差别,上市之前抖点水啊,称的时候再抖两下,我觉得都差不多,这是让人觉得挺无聊的一件事,其实我才不在意这件事,我也不搭理它,比如这个国家是死是活,我也不太在乎,只不过你问到这个问题,就像你问我今天的天气如何,什么沙尘暴啊或者刮风啊,但是这种事又不是你能控制的,这只是国家的一个现状

Q:讲一讲你的博客吧。

A博客很有意思,待会儿就把给你拍的照片放上去,然后很多的人我也都不认识,反正他们一点击就看到了,我就觉得这个是很直接现实同时又是很幻觉的一个事情,所以我就一直在这个事。

Q:就是说它是一个你传播你自己信息的途径?

A:我觉得信息时代是人类遇到的最的一个时代,是第一次给所谓的自由个人意志技术上提供了可能,在这之前,人类一直是在黑暗当中或者是在独木桥上,或者是在一个必由之路上,那么这个信息时代第一次让人有可能自己或者和愿意一起的人,这在过去是没有的,所以我觉得我们应该是很有兴致和很有机会进去这么一种状态,就是说它有几点是非常重要的:自由地表达个人方式。这听上去虽然很俗套,但是这个是很重要的事情,包括交流可能,包括把社会的力量重新地施以影响吸收运用可能,这是很了不起的一件事情。

Q:你觉得在艺术上有没有地域的中心边缘之分?

A:我觉得不存在,尤其是在这个信息时代网络时代就更不存在了,这是人类第一次有机会和有可能把这个传统价值,即所谓的传统的原始、中心和权利彻底瓦解,这个可能性确实是人类挣扎了很多年以后突然蹦出来的,这是一个很了不起的东西。

保险[bao xian] insurance

This movie requires Flash Player 9

农村农民生活水平也在不断的提高,以前农村还要担心养老保险,现在什么都有了.

We used to worry about the endowment insurance, but now we have all these welfares.

(摘自徐坦对林鸿男的访谈   Excerpt from Interview with Lin Hongnan)

采访对象:林鸿男(张江集团物业公司维修工)

采访时间:2006816

 

高科技 Hi-tech 4

高科技开发(技术)园区 Hi-tech Park(zone 3

new 3

农村 village 4

发展 开发 develop development 4

生活 life 4

变化 change 3

进步 progress 1

超越 surpass 1

 

养老保险 age pension endowment insurance 2

劳动力 labor force 1

征收 expropriated 1

拆迁 removed 2

环境 surrounding 2

娱乐场所 recreation places 1

商品房 commercial housing 1

党中央 the central leadership of the Party 1

 

 

 

张江现在是高科技园区,Zhangjiang is a Hi-tech zone now.

几年以前还是一片农田,Years ago it was a field of farm.

党中央开发浦东、张江高科技开发园区,With the development of Pudong and Zhangjiang Hi-tech Park under the central leadership of the Party.

现在楼房一幢幢拔地而起,形成张江高科技技术园区。now buildings one after another are erected to form the Hi-tech Park.

我们亲眼接触的是一天一个变化变化太大。We have been watching the change happening everyday, it’s huge.

张江是中国越来越受关注的地方。Zhangjiang is the place with increasing attention given in China.

以前最早种过田,种过三年田,I had been doing farm work at the beginning, for 3 years.

后来去当了兵,是本地人。Later I joined the army. I’m a native.

农村农民生活水平也在不断地提高,The peasants life is improving constantly.

以前农村还要担心养老保险,现在什么都有了。We used to worry about the age pension, but now we have all these welfares.

以前是生产力、劳动力不能往外走,The labor force used to be forbidden to move outwards

只在这个生产队的田里,做一天工拿几个工分,They could only stay in the working team farm fields and earn a few Gong Fen per day.

现在不一样了,农田征收了,Now these all changed. The fields have been expropriated.

给建了小城镇还有养老保险,The town is established and we are given endowment insurance.

自己可以出去到公司里应聘,We can apply for jobs in the companies,

像我 这里出来也做做外业。like me, do some working outside.

这次胡锦涛也来参观要发展新农村President Hu Jintao came to visit and plan to develop the new village this time.

没有拆迁完的以后也是挺好的新农村 The part that has not been removed is quite neat new village,

什么都有,篮球、娱乐场所,with all the facilities like basketball courts and other recreation places.

以后要开银行医院一切设施都有,Later we will have banks, hospitals and all other facilities.

要是拆迁现在都有商品房,The removed families have commercial housing.

生活环境也不错换个环境,Their new life surrounding is quite nice, too.

生活一天比一天好,跟过去完全不能相比。Life is improving day by day, totally incomparable with the past.

希望今后日子一天比一天更好,Hope life could be getting even better in future;

现在作为一个农民想不到的东西可能会在今后的日子当中都会实现。and what cannot be imagined by a peasant now would become ture.

生活, 变化, Life, Change.

有几个字:发展进步超越。Key words for it: development, progress, surpass.

暴力[bao li] violence

This movie requires Flash Player 9

现在是一个没有、或者不提倡社会,整个社会都不倡导这种价值观。我们从小受的教育是一种很虚假尊敬,我觉得这不是艺术的错误,因为整个社会导向错误的。

We are living in a society without love, or one in which love is not advocated as social value judgment. The education we had from the early years was only fake respect and fake love, so I don’t think art should take the blame – because the whole society is simply going into a wrong direction.

(摘自徐坦对曹斐的访谈  Excerpt from Interview with Cao Fei)

采访对象:艾东明

采访时间:2007131日下午

采访地点:于北京草场地艾家

do” engage in 25

可能 maybe possibility impossible perhaps may 21

社会 society social 19

问题 problem question 17

兴趣 fascinated interested uninterested interest 12

个人 individual 12

方式 ways approaches 10

市场 market 9

价值 value 7

 

政治的 political  1

国家 country  state  4

自由 freedom  free 7

个人表达 individual expression

地下 underground

民主 democratic  2

 

circle 3

money 5

时代 (information/Internet) age 5

play 3

资金 capital 1

poor poverty 4

弱智 retarded 2

face 3

 

Q:先请艾老师说下你对中国当代艺术现状的看法或印象。

A:我不能装作很了解这个事,虽然我一直在北京,经常参与一些策展,我们有艺术文件仓库,有很多艺术的朋友,但是我还不是很了解这个东西,但这两年好像很热闹,而前几年好像都没什么人去搭理它,所以我觉得好像它是一会儿发高烧,一会儿发冷的状态,我觉得可能像是这样,因为现代艺术这一块实际上时间也是很短的,中国实际上虽然有它的现代生活,但这个现代生活在很大程度上是已经由政治的经济的特征定下来的,是一个已经是什么样的体制下的国家了,那么这种个人表达自由政治背景生活条件,以及文化艺术社会中的作用可能,我觉得基本上都是已经限定下来的了,那么通常所称的当代艺术,实际上它能浮出水面,也只是近五、六年的事情,而之前很多人了很多事情实际上都是处在一种半地下的状态的,就是说只是一个很小的,没有被公众话语所关注,对社会的影响实际上也只是在非常小的范围内的,一旦浮出来之后,它主要是在国外的很多展览报导甚至拍卖,好像搞得很热闹,但是这些并没有涉及到这些作品生存环境和所表达的社会形态含义,这些问题探讨并不是很多的,所以它还是一个非常奇怪的结构,但是我们也不能说任何结构是否就是合理的,比如说有的是树,有的是藤,有的是自然界生猛的动物,有的是寄生的动物,而它们都有其自身的合理性,所以尽管中国当代艺术它不是主动有意识地去和这个社会建立某种关系,但是实际上它也反映了过去这几十年的一些问题

Q:你觉得它反映的是一些什么问题呢?

A:反映了中国近几十年中的哲学美学伦理学的彻底解体,新的甚至探讨的可能都还没有建立,因为这个社会仍然是处在大面积的或者主体地否认事实,或者说不承认一些基本的事实,在很多问题上几乎是没有争论的可能,它离民主社会还是很远,虽然它有极大的自由,但这种自由只是建立在旧体制瓦解上的自由,是没有能力控制下的自由,并不是一种很主动的自由,这些都给艺术一些特征

Q:那你怎样看待现在公众对当代艺术的接受方面?

A:我觉得没有什么真正的接受,它只是成为时尚的另外一个门类,杂志、报纸谈到这些问题的时候,你可以看到,它就只能三句五句的谈,但没有一句能够谈到点子上,也不能够深入下去,我觉得这个事儿挺可怜的,就有点像弱智了,中国当代艺术真是扮演了一个弱智角色,当然它有很好的艺术家,有从开始到现在还在很有意思的事情的艺术家,但是这些艺术家,他们探讨的方式都没有得到主流社会认识,甚至连了解也谈不上,现在基本上就是乱七八糟的吧。

Q:那你觉得你参与策划展览之类的活动能否对这种乱七八糟的状况有所作用呢?

A:现在中国展览很多,但是一点帮助和意义都没有,它变成了一些摊贩,就是说像你经常看到的一些摆摊的,一条街卖一样的东西,互相叫板,互相竞争,我觉得这个是为市场设计的,跟艺术没什么关系,完全是为市场设计的,那么这些展览,你仔细看看这些策展人,有几个是像样的?都是心怀鬼胎,怀着各种各样的目的,我觉得这是中国的学术界和知识分子最让人看不起的一点,就是总体不要,整个儿就是彻底的公开张扬不要,这也是少有的一件事,但是啊,就像中国人说的志短,说得太准了,“”还好听点,实际上就是人都很“”了,没什么问题,但它只是一个借口

Q:你刚才讲到市场,那请谈下你对艺术市场的看法。

A:什么东西都能卖,艺术这么高雅的东西当然也能,因为能卖就主要是为了装饰有的家,那么艺术品就成了一个交易的货品的东西了,这个本来挺正常的,只是这个比例有多大?就是在整个大的文化环境当中,它是否变成了唯一问题,是否脆弱到只要它一出现,其他东西就都消失了?我觉得这个是中国的一个很大的问题,当然……我自己这样看,这个事闹成这样挺好笑的,因为好像你这个事的理由都变了,这个东西让你生活的原则和理由都发生变化了,最后就变成好像转换成另外某种价值了,太多人谈论关心这个问题了,如果你不是一个艺术家,只是一个投机商,这个就很正常了,如果你还是一个创作的人,或者说你本来是一个觉得有话才去从事这个行业,觉得对一种方式兴趣——而不是说简单的财、资金和地位可以替换你的那些最早的东西,就不正常和奇怪了。现在我感觉好像都在谈这一块,是挺烦的一件事,市场本身就是不正常的东西,从股票到名牌定的价格,市场本身是无可非议的,一个东西卖五分和卖五千块和卖五万块都是无可非议的,只是说在这个市场背后,这个产品本身的其他价值是否被这个市场价格给彻底冲淡了?这是一个问题

Q:那你自己感兴趣的其实是什么?

A:说老实话,我没有什么兴趣的事,比如我并不是说不喜欢商业这一块或者说对别的什么东西感兴趣,我确实没有太多兴趣的事,可能是我还是比较被动吧,当然总的来说,艺术是我比较兴趣的一个行当,本来我比较感兴趣是因为这里的人比较不功利,比较还有自己的特征,还活得你是你我是我的,但是现在呢?你可以发现,这个艺术的人跟隔壁卖菜的农民没什么差别,上市之前抖点水啊,称的时候再抖两下,我觉得都差不多,这是让人觉得挺无聊的一件事,其实我才不在意这件事,我也不搭理它,比如这个国家是死是活,我也不太在乎,只不过你问到这个问题,就像你问我今天的天气如何,什么沙尘暴啊或者刮风啊,但是这种事又不是你能控制的,这只是国家的一个现状

Q:讲一讲你的博客吧。

A:博客很有意思,待会儿就把给你拍的照片放上去,然后很多的人我也都不认识,反正他们一点击就看到了,我就觉得这个是很直接现实同时又是很幻觉的一个事情,所以我就一直在这个事。

Q:就是说它是一个你传播你自己信息的途径?

A:我觉得信息时代是人类遇到的最的一个时代,是第一次给所谓的自由个人意志技术上提供了可能,在这之前,人类一直是在黑暗当中或者是在独木桥上,或者是在一个必由之路上,那么这个信息时代第一次让人有可能自己或者和愿意一起的人,这在过去是没有的,所以我觉得我们应该是很有兴致和很有机会进去这么一种状态,就是说它有几点是非常重要的:自由地表达个人方式。这听上去虽然很俗套,但是这个是很重要的事情,包括交流可能,包括把社会的力量重新地施以影响吸收运用可能,这是很了不起的一件事情。

Q:你觉得在艺术上有没有地域的中心边缘之分?

A:我觉得不存在,尤其是在这个信息时代网络时代就更不存在了,这是人类第一次有机会和有可能把这个传统价值,即所谓的传统的原始、中心和权利彻底瓦解,这个可能性确实是人类挣扎了很多年以后突然蹦出来的,这是一个很了不起的东西。

白血病[bai xue bing] leucemiz

This movie requires Flash Player 9

1. 1989年5月21号——之前我经常生身体不好,听说不会写字的人也可以开药方,我感觉神奇,想试试自己能否画画,从那开始就会画画了,画的都是方面的一些东西,白血病怎么牙痛怎么心情不愉快怎么

May 21, 1989 – before that I had often been sick due to bad health. I had heard that even illiterates could write prescriptions, which amazed me, so I wondered if I could paint. That was how I started painting, ever since that day. What I painted was stuff related to healing: how do you cure leukemia? How do you cure toothache? How do you cure moodiness?

2. 白血病如何治,就感觉把白血病细胞出来了,感觉是这样。

When painting leukemia, I felt I painted all the leukemia cells – that’s how it felt.

(摘自徐坦对郭凤仪的访谈   Excerpt from Interview with Guo Fengyi)

采访对象:郭丹霞

采访时间:2007127日下午

采访地点:于西安郭家

 

 

理解 comprehend know 7

(画画 paint drawing 199

知道 know 22

文化 culture 12

文化层次 culture level 4

healing cure 11

understand 8

清楚 clear 8

感觉 feel 15

白血病 leukemia leukemic 6

白鳝 white eel 4

自己 self own 20

别人 other people others 18

感觉 feel 24

 

迷信 Superstition 2

 

中国 China Chinese 7

西方 the West Western 5

身体 health Body physically physical condition 8

Qi (energy) 6

spiritual 3

灵气 reiki 2

气功 Qigong 3

生殖器 genitalia 4

神秘 mysterious 3

科技 science 2

经济效益 1economic profit 1

女神 goddess 2

境界 level spiritual level 2

谋杀 murder 2

智(慧)     intelligence intelligent 4

开发 develop development 4

 

 

Q:谈开始画画的情况。

A:1989521——之前我经常生病身体不好,听说不会写字的人也可以开药方,我感觉神奇,想试试自己能否画画,从那开始就会画画了,的都是方面的一些东西,白血病怎么牙痛怎么心情不愉快怎么?我就出来,那些现在都还在。画白血病如何治就感觉白血病细胞出来了,感觉是这样,我是50年代上学、第一批带红领巾的人,出来的东西特别有意思——从那以后什么都出来,就18来都没有放下过。现在想什么就什么,不按什么规定,有时完还去实践一下。我40时就没上班,一直生病,没办法,就开了个调节心情,以前我是搞化验的,化学分析,后来在纸卷、布卷画画1991西安有一个国际意象博览会,让我去参加,我没去,后来拿了几张过去,他们感觉不可思议,我也没什么感觉,我自己也弄不明白的是什么,有时候琢磨琢磨就知道了,了就知道

Q:你认为你的有什么可谈的意义吗?

A:有些我说清楚,有些我可以说清楚……因为我以前老人体痉挛,想着怎么?最后我就出了小胎儿人体走向……那些都是数字组成的,所以在十几年前,我就认为人是由数字组成的,而直到不久之前人们才说染色体是由数字组成的。

Q:你觉得你的创作是和传统有关系,还是受到别的某些方面的影响?

A:我练过气功,它是中国一个非常好的传统,可以开发智慧,练气功就是在练大脑,但不是每个人都能练成的,而我想我有这个艺术天分,因为我是实实在在的,我不想去骗人或赚钱,就是想把身体练好,我现在身体很好。在这种情况下去画画,我觉得在画画过程中可以出很多东西,不管别人怎么说,我感觉画画成了我生活中最重要的东西。我要一个脑袋,最后就出一个人的脑袋,我觉得我太智慧了——后天的学习也是开发智慧的一种方法,我从来不感觉这是一种迷信,这是一种科学

Q:你觉得当代艺术是一个什么概念?

A:我感觉当代艺术很超前,不像以前,我感觉它们都是有生命的,虽然我对美术界里一些传统教育方法不是很理解,但西方裸体绘——在我没画画以前我就感觉不文明;自从我画画以后,就知道那很;更进一步地说,能把好的一面、坏的一面都呈现出来。

Q:你觉得艺术对社会有什么关系?

A:我感觉应该包容一切去研究艺术,不管是传统文化的或者别的,只要它存在这个社会中,就有价值,我觉得这就是一种前景。我和你们不一样,你们是了以后才,但我是好了以后才,所以我也不愿意去和别人交流。我想什么就什么,特别是我不知道的东西我越能好,我经常看电视的科技频道西方已经中国没有的东西,我就,一个台湾人说我的凝动艺术,是艺术的最高境界。我感觉画画里面有很好的艺术,但它的价值不在于艺术,在于比艺术要好、要深奥得多的东西。举个例子,西安有什么我就什么,出来我就研究,虽然是出来了,但里面还有很多可研究的东西。我武则天的坟陵——少陵,就画了一个小丑坐在她的肚脐眼上,而“少陵”原来是“笑陵”,是用谐音掩盖真实的东西,这个地方是她选择好,还是本来就适合她安葬呢?我认为这里面就有很多道理。

Q:你觉得艺术家自身是什么样的角色?

A:我感觉艺术家应该是全面的,如果只是表面,但不传神,就是得不好。我认为自己是一个多重身份的人,不简单是一个,比如我可以检查生病与否,可以通过绘画别人的病好,还可以自己,我今年67了,身体很好。很多到一定境界 身体都是很的,年龄都很,也是在,来疏通自己大脑,所以都很

Q:你觉得艺术家在社会中有什么作用?。

A:通过可以表达自己意思推动社会前进,像现在的东西,特别是当代艺术,我也去看——我问“乌托邦”是什么?他们说是美好的东西。我感觉我的是代表东方文化,不仅仅是我个人的,也是属于大家的。

Q:那你在不在意你的画是否被别人理解?

A:不在意。每个人的文化层次不一样,很多文化层次的人看得我的文化层次高的人反而看。新加坡的一个院长,说我的是生殖器,但我都不知道生殖器怎么的;我希望把中国文化宣传出去,我是一个受过现代教育的人,我的就是当代,我没搞封建迷信

Q:描述你的创作过程。

A:比如某人,把某人的名字写一下就出来了,简单的几笔五官就特别没见过的都能出来,出来后还能说出这个人相关的一些事情,在我的笔下都能感受出来,这是我从对象身上感应过来的,不是无中生有的……我感觉世界博大了,应该去描述很多东西,包括宇宙……我知道的东西我都,我了就能去深入知道一些东西,虽然不是全部……我知道很多东西,特别是一些审美的东西,比如说红山文化女神,我想知道女神到底是什么样子的?西安有很悠久文化历史,在临潼发现遗址后我就把这一系列出来了,看看是否很神秘。以前有画家最怕别人提问题,我不害怕提问题,想让我什么我都出来,越是不知道的东西越得好,比如说金字塔完后我才知道金字塔是葬法老的地方,之前知道

白领[bai ling] white-colar


This movie requires Flash Player 9

张江这里的餐饮等方面行业,都集中在地铁站附近,或是在产业园区内,交通上不方便啦,只有几趟公交车,大部分来张江工作的人,都是IT行业的领导和白领,都拥有自己的交通工具,这也是张江的一大特色,车比较多,人也比较繁忙。

Service industry such as restaurants in Zhangjiang Hi-Tech Park congregates around the subway station and inside the industry garden. Its public transportation is inconvenient with only a few bus routes. Most of the people working here are leaders or white collar employees of IT industry, who have their own cars, which is one of the characteristics of Zhangjiang with abundant vehicles and crowded people.

(摘自徐坦对姚宇的访谈   Excerpt from Interview with YaoYu)

采访对象:姚宇(张江某广告公司设计师)

采访时间:2006818

 

发展 develop development 9

气氛 ambience 5

高科技 hi-tech 3

园区 garden zone 5

科技 technology technological 10

产业 industry business 6

创意产业 creative industry 3

感觉 feeling felt 3

文化 culture 9

文化产业 culture business 1

生活 life 6

busy 2

行业 industry 2

都市 metropolitan 2

公交 bus 1

IT行业 IT industry 1

白领 white-collar 1

特色 characteristics 1

规划 layout 1

高端 high-end 1

自动化 automatic 1

电子化 electronic 1

科技化 scientific 1

人性化 humanized 1

理想 ideal 2

知识 knowledegs 1

环境 surroundings 1

家居 home 1

田园风光 pastoral 2

 

 

 

刚来张江时,给我总体的感觉来说,My first feeling when I just came here,

就是早上很,大量的人在等班车, was its busy morning.Lots of people were waiting for the bus.

工作的节奏气氛很强烈,很有都市工作的气氛。Here is the tense working ambience,quite metropolitan.

随后当我在张江工作了一段时间,后来对张江的感觉,After a period of working here, I felt something else.

就是在张江这里的餐饮等方面行业,都集中在地铁站附近,Restaurants in Zhangjiang are centered near the subway station,

或是在产业园区内,or in the industry garden.

交通不方便啦,只有几趟公交车,Its transportation is inconvenient with only a few bus routes.

大部分来张江工作的人,都是IT行业的领导和白领,Most of the people working here are leaders or white-collar employees of IT industry,

都拥有自己的交通工具,这也是张江的一大特色,who have their own cars, which is one of the characteristics of Zhangjiang,

车比较多,人也比较繁,with abundant vehicles and crowded people.

我来张江后,对张江的感觉,基本上很满意。Basically I am satisfied since I came here,

特别是对园区规划气氛,整体的建设,以及文化。 especially with its zone layout, ambience and the overall construstion and culture.

我们是做文化产业的,We do culture business.

我们中国艺术设计联盟,整体上是创意产业的门户, Our China Art Design Union is basically the portal of creative industry.

主要是要对文化各个方面的气氛进行感受,Primarily we sense various aspects of cultural ambience.

创意产业文化基地,在张江建立以后,Since the establishment of the creative industry culture base,

文化气氛十分强烈,the cultural ambience is getting stronger.

周围也建立了文化素养较高的基地,如美院电影学院,Around have been built bases with higher cultural accomplishment like the Art College and the Film College,

整个文化科技素质都提高了,raising the overall cultural and technological quality

很适合我们创意产业的精神,which just fits our concept of creative industry.

文化加科学,一个很明确的整体的发展目标Culture and science make an explicit target of development as a whole.

 

我对生活理想化想象,希望今后生活自动化电子化、更科技化人性化,My imagination of the ideal life is a more automatic, electronic, scientific and humanized one,

自己拥有一些站在科技高端尖端情况下的生活设施,with some latest hi-tech life facilities

比如说家居环境,用一些最科技,最新的产品来美化,完善自己的生活。like the home surroundings, decorated and improved with the latest technology and products.

 

 

社会是一个机械化的大熔炉, The society is an automatic melting pot.

社会在不断发展,我们自身也在不断进步, With its consistant development, we are developing ourselves, too.

发展是肯定的目标, Development is the target for sure,

发展,就会被社会和历史淘汰, or we would be  washed out.

张江是立足于IT高科技园区的理念。Zhangjiang is based on the idea of IT hi-tech zone.

我希望张江今后的发展多元化多极化的。I hope its development be multipolized,

不光在科技领域,也可以在其他领域进行尝试,one in technological area as well as many others.

尝试将张江建设成文化科技各方面知识溶和在一起的园区, The attempt to built a zone involving all the knowledegs including culture and technology,

这更利于张江的发展。would be more profer for it.

田园风光似的生活不是年轻人的生活理想,The pastoral life is not ideal for the young,

年轻人应该充分发挥积极性,充分溶入社会,推动社会发展,who should make full use of their energy and develop our socity.

如果年纪稍长,也经历了自身的发展,生活也已精彩过了,Those senior ones who have experienced enough,

可以考虑过一种安逸的,田园风光似的生活。could think about an easy pastoral life.

 

推动社会发展的力量是科技。 Science and technology is the force to make society develop forward.

张江,高科技产业的快车。Zhangjiang, an express train of hi-tech industry,

高科技,高精尖技术的发源地。 a cradle of hi-tech and advanced technology.

 

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